{"id":127886,"date":"2022-09-06T15:00:00","date_gmt":"2022-09-06T15:00:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.nintendolife.com\/#article-137167"},"modified":"2022-09-06T15:00:00","modified_gmt":"2022-09-06T15:00:00","slug":"feature-unfinished-business-why-gilbert-grossman-returned-to-monkey-island","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/sickgaming.net\/blog\/2022\/09\/06\/feature-unfinished-business-why-gilbert-grossman-returned-to-monkey-island\/","title":{"rendered":"Feature: “Unfinished Business” – Why Gilbert & Grossman Returned To Monkey Island"},"content":{"rendered":"
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\"Return<\/a>
Image: Devolver Digital \/ Disney<\/em><\/figcaption><\/figure>\n

Does Guybrush Threepwood still<\/em> want to be a pirate?<\/p>\n

This, after all, was the Monkey Island<\/strong> protagonist\u2019s very first proclamation 32 years ago: \u201cMy name is Guybrush Threepwood, and I want to be a pirate!\u201d<\/p>\n

But given the fact that he\u2019s only set sail in five previous Monkey Island adventures sprinkled across more than three decades, not to mention the 12-year gap in Threepwood\u2019s resume (his most recent job being TellTale\u2019s Tales of Monkey Island<\/a>), you\u2019d be forgiven if you decided to place Threepwood\u2019s pirate resume on the rejection pile. But the once-LucasArts property still has one last story to tell.<\/p>\n

Return to Monkey Island<\/a>, in all its point-and-click<\/a> glory, is releasing for both Nintendo Switch and PC on September 19th. The revival comes by way of series creator Ron Gilbert<\/strong>, long-time co-writer and Monkey Island veteran Dave Grossman<\/strong>, and with help from the taste-makers over at Devolver Digital<\/strong> acting as co-producers. This is the writing duo\u2019s first time directly working on a Monkey Island game together in 30 years.<\/p>\n

We caught up with Gilbert and Grossman at PAX West to discuss Monkey Island\u2019s (very) long-awaited return, touching on why point-and-click games deserve a space in 2022, how they settled on the new game\u2019s surprisingly divisive art style, and what other LucasArts games they\u2019d maybe resurrect in the future.<\/p>\n

Note. This interview contains spoilers for the ending of Monkey Island 2 \u2014 if you’re sensitive to this information and want to read on, we advise you to skip the two answers after Gilbert begins discussing the game.<\/em><\/p>\n

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Nintendo Life (Alan Lopez)<\/strong>: I\u2019d like to start off with kind of a broad statement, which will lead me to my first question.<\/strong> To prep for this interview, I went back and tinkered with the original first two games for the first time since I was a child. It was a really interesting experience with a couple of takeaways. I was amazed at how well the original games finessed the hardware to really make a true sense of place, and the animations were also ahead of their time. The point-and-clicking interface also forced me to become more invested in the dialogue.<\/strong><\/p>\n

Obviously, none of that stuff is necessary in 2022. You don\u2019t necessarily need to finesse hardware, or point and click. Your cohort Tim Schafer<\/strong> [editor\u2019s note: Schafer co-wrote the original two Monkey Island games] went on to work within other genres, while both of you have stayed relatively faithful to the point-and-click genre.<\/strong><\/p>\n

So to start off the interview, my first question to you is: Why? What does point-and-click as a genre bring to the medium of games in 2022?<\/strong><\/p>\n

Ron Gilbert:<\/strong> Yeah, I think point-and-click, I really like it as a vehicle for storytelling. I like the way you interact with the world, kind of very viscerally. Clicking on stuff, and moving the mouse on stuff \u2013 or with a controller, but it\u2019s the same thing \u2013 it\u2019s like, you really are kinda looking<\/em> at the world. I\u2019ve always enjoyed that. I like that these games are sort of like sandboxes in that way. I just really like point-and-click a lot\u2026 I really like 2D.<\/p>\n

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adventure games work best when the player and the main character are on an equal standing of knowledge<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n

<\/blockquote>\n

Dave Grossman:<\/strong> I like the writing part best, that\u2019s sort of my favorite bit. Adventure games in general, and especially in point-and-click, is where you get to do a lot of that, and that makes me happy.<\/p>\n

And also, I\u2019m interested in structure and form, and the ways that you can sort of use puzzles to shape the experience for the player without specifically forcing the player to go A to B, you [instead] make it necessary for them to do that, and you can impose the hand of fate on the experience without meddling too much in the details. That has never<\/em> gotten old for me.<\/p>\n

Another thing that struck me when I went back and played the games\u2026the genre forces you to [use] an interface that is very specific. But what really helped immerse me and [let me] buy into that interface was that in the Monkey Island games, and to some extent Maniac Mansion<\/a> as well, the characters had no idea<\/em> what was happening in their world just as much as I<\/em> had no idea what was happening. Was that intentional?<\/strong><\/p>\n

Gilbert:<\/strong> Oh yeah, very much so. I think, a lot of that came from when I was doing Maniac Mansion. I played some of Sierra\u2019s games to kind of see what they were like, and I remember very specifically playing Police Quest<\/strong>. And I remember starting the game off, and you come off your shift, you go into the police station\u2026 and I was almost immediately<\/em> fired from the police force\u2026because I didn\u2019t put my gun in my locker.<\/p>\n

And that moment, what it told me was that I\u2019m a police officer on a police force, and I should already know<\/em> that I have to put my gun in my locker. There was this intrinsic knowledge that the character should have that I as the player did not<\/em> have. And I just felt that was a disconnect.<\/p>\n

And it\u2019s really why in Monkey Island, the first line out of Guybrush\u2019s mouth is, \u201cMy name is Guybrush Threepwood and I want to be a pirate.\u201d So the player is learning to be a pirate at the same time Guybrush is learning to be a pirate. I think adventure games work best when the player and the main character are on an equal standing of knowledge.<\/p>\n

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Image: Devolver Digital \/ Disney<\/em><\/figcaption><\/figure>\n

So relating that to the new game, do you have any concern Guybrush is getting too savvy? [laughter]<\/strong><\/p>\n

Gilbert:<\/strong> I mean, he knows how to be a pirate now, but we\u2019re asking him to do other things that Guybrush does not know how to do. So you\u2019re still at that same level of, \u201cI don\u2019t have any more knowledge than Guybrush has.\u201d<\/p>\n

Grossman:<\/strong> Enthusiastic mild competence.<\/p>\n

Enthusiastic mild competence\u2026 [laughter]<\/strong><\/p>\n

Grossman:<\/strong> Semi-competence.<\/p>\n

So the new game is sequential after the second Monkey Island, but it\u2019s reportedly \u201cnot a sequel\u201d. Before I ask you to explain what that means, Dave, you were involved with the newer Telltale games. So when you guys came together to make this one, how did you both decide where in the story it should both start?<\/strong><\/p>\n

Gilbert:<\/strong> I think one of the unmoveable stakes for me was that the game had to start right after Monkey Island 2<\/a>, because the game sort of left on a weird, weird<\/em> cliffhanger and I think the other games did their best \u2013 and did a good job \u2013 of trying to get out of that. But I really wanted to start there and kind of address the strange ending.<\/p>\n

And then, I don\u2019t wanna spoil what happens, but the game does start at the end, right at that point. And things kind of get bizarre.<\/p>\n

So the game literally starts \u2014 can I say this? \u2013 at a theme park?<\/strong><\/p>\n

Gilbert:<\/strong> Y-….yes. I mean\u2026without saying \u201cyes\u201d\u2026yes. [laughter]<\/p>\n

Grossman:<\/strong> I don\u2019t know that we had much choice about that really, because the whole point of the project is about unfinished business, and there\u2019s this thing left hanging in our own past. And our story begins about unfinished business, so it sort of wraps them together, and it was kind of the only thing that made sense, to start it there.<\/p>\n

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Image: Devolver Digital \/ Disney<\/em><\/figcaption><\/figure>\n
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the whole point of the project is about unfinished business, and there\u2019s this thing left hanging in our own past<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n

<\/blockquote>\n

I pretty much have to ask this question\u2026 when you launched the trailer, there was a lot of, uh, feedback on the artistic aesthetic.<\/strong><\/p>\n

Gilbert:<\/strong> [laughter]<\/p>\n

I guess\u2026my question to you, Ron: Is pixel art in point-and-click games trivial? Or does it somehow add something to the experience, which people almost feel [cheated out] of some specific kind of experience [when it’s missing]? And I\u2019d add that the original Monkey Island games technically weren\u2019t created with pixel art.<\/strong><\/p>\n

Gilbert:<\/strong> I think the originals are what people today<\/em> call \u201cpixel art\u201d. We never<\/em> called them pixel art. Those were words that never entered our vocabulary back then. Because we were just looking at this hardware that we had and trying to take every advantage of the hardware possible. And you know, there were some limitations\u2026we had 320×200 resolution and only so many colors. But as hardware progressed, you look at the original Monkey 1<\/a>, it was all EGA art, 16 colors, and then we moved it to VGA art when Monkey 2 came out, and we always kept pushing (the graphics) forward. We never said, \u201cOh, this is the definitive look.\u201d I think we\u2019ve always pushed things forward, always.<\/p>\n

And so there was a reaction<\/a> to [Return to Monkey Island] not being pixel art, but I think it\u2019s nostalgia reasons that people have. A lot of people\u2026they want to experience this Monkey Island exactly<\/em> like they experienced Monkey Island 2. And that\u2019s just\u2026 not possible. Even if we had done a pixel art game, there would be a huge number of people who loved Monkey Island 3<\/a> and would be upset that we didn\u2019t do that<\/em> art style.<\/p>\n

I think it\u2019s just kind of a thing with a (franchise) with such a history and fan base, you are going to offend a whole bunch of people no matter what you do. And the conversation that Dave and I had originally\u2026we [asked] ourselves, should we do pixel art? Should we not<\/em> do it? And what we landed on was, no matter what we do, we\u2019re gonna offend a whole bunch of people with our choice. So let\u2019s make the choice that is something we<\/em> want to do. A choice that sorta pushes things forward.<\/p>\n

Grossman:<\/strong> And pixel art is sort of for<\/em> nostalgia. As soon as you look at something that is pixel art, you know that it\u2019s trying to make you feel nostalgic. And this game will<\/em> invoke feelings of nostalgia in some people, but that is not the point at all. We\u2019re trying to make a new thing.<\/p>\n

To that point, what do you think someone who\u2019s never played Monkey Island will get out of this game, as opposed to a hardcore fan?<\/strong><\/p>\n

Gilbert:<\/strong> I hope that people who\u2019ve never played [Monkey Island] have a super enjoyable experience, and they might go, \u201cOh, so this is what Monkey Island is about.\u201d<\/p>\n

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we [asked] ourselves, should we do pixel art? Should we not<\/em> do it? No matter what we do, we\u2019re gonna offend a whole bunch of people<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n

Grossman:<\/strong> We\u2019ve tested it on a few people who have never heard of Monkey Island. And yes, there are<\/em> people who have never heard of Monkey Island, they exist, and we found them. And we let them play the game and they enjoyed it.<\/p>\n

Is it a standalone experience?<\/strong><\/p>\n

Gilbert:<\/strong> Yes, it\u2019s a very standalone experience. That\u2019s not to say we don\u2019t leverage a whole bunch of things, and continue [old] stories and continue characters\u2026 but we\u2019ve really tried to reintroduce characters and reintroduce scenarios. We don\u2019t just assume<\/em> [after] you walk into a room you\u2019ll know who Otis is\u2026we always try to do that.<\/p>\n

Grossman:<\/strong> And I think every game in the series has done that. You can start with any of them.<\/p>\n

\"10\"<\/a>
Image: Devolver Digital \/ Disney<\/em><\/figcaption><\/figure>\n

When you were talking about the pixel art, I realized I must have had a similar reaction as a child between Maniac Mansion and [its sequel] Day of the Tentacle<\/a>, where I thought to myself, \u201cWhy does this look different?\u201d But there was no social media. [laughter]<\/strong><\/p>\n

Gilbert:<\/strong> You had nobody to be angry at!<\/p>\n

Not super long ago, after Disney bought LucasArts Games, there was an online petition to sell the Monkey Island property to you, specifically, Ron\u2026not that this is how it works, but\u2026my question to you is, how did we get from that point to today?<\/strong><\/p>\n

Gilbert:<\/strong> Yeah I mean\u2026the petitions are fun. I mean, I don\u2019t think a petition is going to get Disney to sell us something\u2026<\/p>\n

Grossman:<\/strong> It\u2019s a nice way for people to show how they feel.<\/p>\n

Gilbert:<\/strong> Yes, and you know, I poked around initially, right after the sale of (LucasArts games) to Disney. I kind of knew some people, and basically I was told, \u201cNo. No, we\u2019re not going to sell it. Don\u2019t ask. It\u2019s not for sale.\u201d So I don\u2019t think it\u2019s an issue of money<\/em>\u2026I mean, if I came to them with a billion dollars they might sell it. But there\u2019s no reasonable amount of money where they\u2019d sell it.<\/p>\n

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there\u2019s no reasonable amount of money where [Disney] would sell it<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n

That\u2019s kind of when I thought, \u201cOkay, I\u2019m probably not gonna do this.\u201d And I went on to do other things, I made Thimbleweed Park<\/a> and other things and stuff\u2026but then Devolver contacted me. [Nigel Lowrie, co-founder of Devolver Digital] knew somebody at the Disney licensing department. And he said he might have an avenue to license, and he wanted to know if I would be interested in making that game.<\/p>\n

And I actually had a lot of trepidation about it. So I called up Dave and told him about it, and we got together and we spent a weekend kind of brainstorming what the game could be. Because we wanted to make sure if we built another Monkey Island, we wanted it to be a meaningful game. We didn\u2019t want to just slap out something with the IP. And we came up with something that we really liked a lot.<\/p>\n

So that\u2019s when I went back to Devolver and said, \u201cOkay, if you can make this happen\u2026\u201d<\/p>\n

And they made it happen!<\/strong><\/p>\n

Gilbert:<\/strong> They made it happen. And it was a very long<\/em> (process). It took almost nine months before (we started development) between contract negotiations, Disney, and everything.<\/p>\n

Grossman:<\/strong> There are lots of \u201cI\u2019s\u201d and \u201cT\u2019s\u201d in these things.<\/p>\n

A quick anecdote\u2026I was in the media room here at PAX and I saw somebody I knew in there, and while catching up I told him I was going to interview you two and asked if they had any questions I might add. And an older gentleman on the other end of the room overhead this and yelled out, \u201cWhat took them so long?!\u201d<\/strong><\/p>\n

Group:<\/strong> [laughter]<\/p>\n

Grossman:<\/strong> Well we kind of grabbed the first opportunity, didn\u2019t we Ron?<\/p>\n

\"A01\"<\/a>
Image: Devolver Digital \/ Disney<\/em><\/figcaption><\/figure>\n

So did you work directly with Disney?<\/strong><\/p>\n

Gilbert:<\/strong> Oh yeah, a lot. We worked a lot with Disney on this game. But one of the stipulations I had on Return to Monkey Island was that I wanted to make the game we<\/em> wanted to make. I didn\u2019t want interference from Devolver or Disney or whoever. I wanted to make this<\/em> game.<\/p>\n

And Disney said okay, and they were very true to their word.<\/p>\n

Have you been working on Monkey Island for the last two years?<\/strong><\/p>\n

Gilbert:<\/strong> Oh yeah. We had to keep this so<\/em> secret. I didn\u2019t even want to drop hints that I was working on a new Monkey Island game.<\/p>\n

Devolver told me earlier that there were plenty of people within their own company that didn\u2019t even know about it.<\/strong><\/p>\n

Grossman:<\/strong> I told my wife, but not my son.<\/p>\n

Group:<\/strong> [laughter]<\/p>\n

Gilbert:<\/strong> I got an angry email from one of my best friends, he was like, \u201cHow could you not tell me?!” [laughter]<\/p>\n

[At this point Devolver PR tells us there\u2019s only time for one more question]<\/p>\n

Alright\u2026my last question is, when will there be Maniac Mansion 3?<\/strong><\/p>\n

Group:<\/strong> [laughter]<\/p>\n

Gilbert:<\/strong> I think every game I\u2019ve ever worked on, I get to [the end] of game development and I\u2019m like, I never want to make another game again. I\u2019m done. I\u2019m quitting. And then three months later I\u2019m like, yeah, okay, this is a lot of fun. This worked out well.<\/p>\n

So\u2026I can\u2019t answer that question right now<\/em>. Hit me up in three or four months. [laughter]<\/p>\n

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Our thanks to Ron and Dave for their time. Return to Monkey Island launches on Switch and PC on 19th September.<\/em><\/p>\n