{"id":122568,"date":"2020-12-26T12:00:00","date_gmt":"2020-12-26T12:00:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.nintendolife.com\/news\/2020\/12\/best_of_2020_sam_barlow_on_bringing_telling_lies_to_switch_his_directing_style_and_his_next_project"},"modified":"2020-12-26T12:00:00","modified_gmt":"2020-12-26T12:00:00","slug":"best-of-2020-sam-barlow-on-bringing-telling-lies-to-switch-his-directing-style-and-his-next-project","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/sickgaming.net\/blog\/2020\/12\/26\/best-of-2020-sam-barlow-on-bringing-telling-lies-to-switch-his-directing-style-and-his-next-project\/","title":{"rendered":"Best Of 2020: Sam Barlow On Bringing Telling Lies To Switch, His Directing Style, And His Next Project"},"content":{"rendered":"<div class=\"media_block\"><a href=\"https:\/\/images.nintendolife.com\/d79bb2decbc9e\/large.jpg\"><img decoding=\"async\" src=\"https:\/\/images.nintendolife.com\/d79bb2decbc9e\/small.jpg\" class=\"media_thumbnail\"><\/a><\/div>\n<figure class=\"picture strip\"><a title=\"Telling Lies Nintendo Switch\" href=\"https:\/\/images.nintendolife.com\/67be546dc816a\/telling-lies-nintendo-switch.original.jpg\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"lazy\" src=\"\/\/www.w3.org\/2000\/svg' viewBox='0 0 900 507'%3E%3C\/svg%3E\" width=\"900\" height=\"507\" data-original=\"https:\/\/images.nintendolife.com\/67be546dc816a\/telling-lies-nintendo-switch.900x.jpg\" alt=\"Telling Lies Nintendo Switch\"><\/a><\/figure>\n<p><em>Over the holiday season we&#8217;ll be republishing a series of Nintendo Life articles, interviews and other features from the previous twelve months that we consider to be our <a href=\"https:\/\/www.nintendolife.com\/tags\/best-of-2020\">Best of 2020<\/a>. Hopefully, this will give you a chance to catch up on pieces you missed, or simply enjoy looking back on a year which did have some highlights \u2014 honest!<\/em><\/p>\n<p><em>This interview was originally published in May 2020.<\/em><\/p>\n<hr>\n<p>For many gamers the term &#8216;FMV&#8217; may still be loaded with memories of shlocky &#8216;cinematic&#8217; clips crammed into games in the early 1990s. The memory space of the CD-ROM enabled developers to &#8216;wow&#8217; people who had invested in their first personal computer with compressed video clips, not to mention the poor gamers who until then had had to &#8216;make do&#8217; with pixelated blips and blobs. When the clips weren&#8217;t simply serving as cutscenes, the results generally ranged from <em>so-bad-they&#8217;re-good<\/em> to <em>just-plain-bad<\/em>, and it has taken a long time for the genre to shake its reputation for low-quality video and lower-quality acting.<\/p>\n<p>We&#8217;ve come a long way since then, of course, and there is a small and select group of developers still exploring the potential of interactive movies, and none are more interesting than Sam Barlow. Having previously worked on the Silent Hill franchise (notably, the excellent <strong><a href=\"https:\/\/www.nintendolife.com\/games\/wii\/silent_hill_shattered_memories\">Silent Hill: Shattered Memories<\/a><\/strong> for Wii), Barlow struck out on his own with the engrossing interactive hit <strong>Her Story<\/strong> in 2015.<\/p>\n<p>A collaboration with developer Furious Bee, <strong><a href=\"https:\/\/www.nintendolife.com\/games\/switch-eshop\/telling_lies\">Telling Lies<\/a><\/strong> is a spiritual sequel of sorts; a detective thriller which has you reviewing NSA footage of four protagonists&#8217; intimate conversations over a 2-year period. <a href=\"https:\/\/www.nintendolife.com\/reviews\/switch-eshop\/telling_lies\">We very much enjoyed the game<\/a> and recently had the chance to question its creator about the logistics of making a compelling interactive movie, the process of bringing it to consoles, and returning to the horror genre with his next project&#8230;<\/p>\n<hr>\n<p><strong>Nintendo Life: First off, just how do you go about writing something like Telling Lies? With so many intricate links and relationships for the player to uncover in a non-linear fashion, do you write it \u2018straight\u2019 and find the complexity in the edit? Tell us about the writing process.<\/strong><\/p>\n<p><strong>Sam Barlow:<\/strong> The process I kinda developed across Her Story and Telling Lies was to spend a lot of time up front on the research, the character\u2019s lives, back stories, etc. so that when we get into the plot of the game itself we have enough layers built up to support players really digging into it. So that in any given moment there are two or three things happening at once in people\u2019s minds.<\/p>\n<figure class=\"picture strip\"><a title=\"Telling Lies Switch Screenshot 02\" href=\"https:\/\/images.nintendolife.com\/462315ca48730\/telling-lies-switch-screenshot-02.original.jpg\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"lazy\" src=\"\/\/www.w3.org\/2000\/svg' viewBox='0 0 900 506'%3E%3C\/svg%3E\" width=\"900\" height=\"506\" data-original=\"https:\/\/images.nintendolife.com\/462315ca48730\/telling-lies-switch-screenshot-02.900x.jpg\" alt=\"Telling Lies Switch Screenshot 02\"><\/a><\/figure>\n<p>With Telling Lies it was important to carefully map out the main characters\u2019 lives over the two years of the story, ensure those stories sparked off each other and were well balanced against each other. I can tell you what each of them was doing for every day of that period! Then we write the scenes and really just do that from the characters\u2019 perspectives, trying to create interestingly authentic, organic moments. Finally, we then have a stage where the computer analyzes the script and points out balancing issues. Scenes with no good searches to find them, words that are over or under used. We iterate and iterate from here, tweaking scenes until the computer thinks things are fine.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Anyone who played Her Story will feel immediately at home with the RETINA system and its keyword searches, which feels beautifully weighted in the amount of information it displays while letting the player piece clues together. After the success of Her Story, did you feel hesitant at all to return a similar set-up for Telling Lies?<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>Definitely when Her Story came out I wasn\u2019t keen to jump into a direct sequel. But once time had passed I was interested in exploring further the element of Her Story that I thought were most unique \u2014 the idea of exploring story\/video in the way you would a 3D world in a normal game. I wanted to see how we could build on that idea, whilst telling a very different story on a very different (bigger!) canvas.<\/p>\n<p>One of the weird things about creating a new genre is how the games are seen to look the same. If I was making a military FPS, I could tweak something tiny \u2014 say the reload mechanic \u2014 and it would be seen as a big innovation. But because Her Story is such a radically different game in itself, even though Telling Lies has many departures from the first game, from a distance it looks the same! To me the games feel like siblings \u2014 they share the same parents and genetics, but end up growing into two very different individuals!<\/p>\n<blockquote class=\"right\">\n<p>If I was making a military FPS, I could tweak something tiny \u2014 say the reload mechanic \u2014 and it would be seen as a big innovation.<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<p><strong>Finding that delicate keyword balance to create intrigue must have been tough to achieve, and doesn\u2019t seem like the sort of thing that\u2019s easy to change after the footage is in the can. How do you strike the right balance? How do you playtest and tweak a game like this?<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>We played the game as we developed the script. We had a program that would turn the script into fake movie clips with timed out subtitles. So we\u2019d \u201cplay\u201d it and get a sense for the scope of it, the way things were laid out. Then once we had a full script that we liked and that the computer liked we recorded a read through with actors and myself, just talking heads, over a few days. We used that footage to make an alpha build of the game and put that through several play tests. We\u2019d have people play for 3-4 hours and track their progress. It was reassuring to see how well people \u2018got\u2019 the experience even with very simple footage \u2014 and we used the data to help tweak some areas and improve the general flow and balance of things. Once <em>that<\/em> script was then locked we moved into production&#8230;<\/p>\n<aside class=\"gallery\">\n<div class=\"col\"><a title=\"Telling Lies Switch Screenshot 03\" href=\"https:\/\/images.nintendolife.com\/fc736f7a2c0e3\/telling-lies-switch-screenshot-03.original.jpg\"><img decoding=\"async\" class=\"lazy\" src=\"https:\/\/static.nintendolife.com\/blank.gif\" data-original=\"https:\/\/images.nintendolife.com\/fc736f7a2c0e3\/telling-lies-switch-screenshot-03.original.jpg\" alt=\"Telling Lies Switch Screenshot 03\"><\/a><\/div>\n<div class=\"col\"><a title=\"Telling Lies Switch Screenshot 01\" href=\"https:\/\/images.nintendolife.com\/d79bb2decbc9e\/telling-lies-switch-screenshot-01.original.jpg\"><img decoding=\"async\" class=\"lazy\" src=\"https:\/\/static.nintendolife.com\/blank.gif\" data-original=\"https:\/\/images.nintendolife.com\/d79bb2decbc9e\/telling-lies-switch-screenshot-01.original.jpg\" alt=\"Telling Lies Switch Screenshot 01\"><\/a><\/div>\n<\/aside>\n<p><strong>Tell us a little about the filming. We\u2019ve read that it mainly took place in a single studio \u2018compound\u2019. In comparison to Her Story and its single actor\/location, a cast of actors and multiple settings must have made this infinitely more complex to coordinate, logistically. How long did filming take?<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>We shot for five weeks with about the same amount of time spent in pre-production and the lead up to the shoot. That\u2019s a pretty intense shoot for the amount of content we had to capture! But everything was organized to prioritize the actors \u2014 give them a setup where they could be very natural, where they could play off of each other. So we would shoot simultaneously on two locations and the actors were free to move around in those spaces, to block things out in a way that was true to the body language, the way you\u2019d move around in spaces like that. You can tell who is talking to who just from how they answer the call, how they move.<\/p>\n<p>Because the actors were free to point the cameras anywhere, it was important to shoot on location rather than on a set \u2014 and we lucked out, finding an area where we basically took over two homes, three apartments, a cafe <em>and<\/em> a small TV studio across the road. We wired it all up so we were able to be in real places, but run two crews at once.<\/p>\n<blockquote class=\"left\">\n<p>Because the actors were free to point the cameras anywhere, it was important to shoot on location rather than on a set \u2014 and we lucked out<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<p><strong>Presumably the actors have to follow the script very precisely. Was there any room for ad-libbing or ideas on set which you incorporated later, or was everything mapped out and nailed down beforehand?<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>Yeah, once we\u2019d tested the script, we had to stick pretty close to it! On set, the script supervisor had a program that would tell her if a word missed (or added!) was going to break things and we could use that to catch any problems that required us to go again and get another take. The biggest challenge was having the actors not ad-lib words in the most heated scenes where it feels natural to just let words come out. They did a hell of a job!<\/p>\n<p><strong>Would you say you\u2019re a hands-on director? Which part of the process of making games like these do you enjoy best?<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>Yeah, I like to get into the weeds. I\u2019m a tweaker, whether that\u2019s nudging a small setting on a post process effect by 0.01, or messing the arrangement of a small piece of set dressing. Anything I can get into, I will!<\/p>\n<p>In terms of my favorite part\u2026 it\u2019s a toss up between breaking the story \u2014 seeing the outline of the story start to take shape and become real \u2014 and being on set with the actors. Walking in the spaces that a few months prior were just words on a page and seeing the actors bring stuff to life and making it special. It\u2019s a real privilege. I also like to play the game once we have the content in, lose myself in the exploration of the footage \u2014 even though I know what\u2019s in there, I still love that core experience!<\/p>\n<figure class=\"picture strip\"><a title=\"Telling Lies Switch Screenshot 04\" href=\"https:\/\/images.nintendolife.com\/40b39330bc8cd\/telling-lies-switch-screenshot-04.original.jpg\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"lazy\" src=\"\/\/www.w3.org\/2000\/svg' viewBox='0 0 900 506'%3E%3C\/svg%3E\" width=\"900\" height=\"506\" data-original=\"https:\/\/images.nintendolife.com\/40b39330bc8cd\/telling-lies-switch-screenshot-04.900x.jpg\" alt=\"Telling Lies Switch Screenshot 04\"><\/a><\/figure>\n<p><strong>We imagine this sort of game presents unique challenges when it comes to \u2018selling\u2019 it to players. Obviously, spoiling the experience isn\u2019t an option, but random cam shots of people talking to a screen don&#8217;t convey the thrill of following narrative threads and playing detective, either. Is this something you\u2019ve worried about?<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>I think you have to lean into the mystery \u2014 you can be opaque to some extent, if you\u2019re confident that players are going to want to rise to that challenge. I like to aim for a good kind of \u2018<em>what the f**k?<\/em>\u2019, the kind where a player wants to find out what the hell this thing is. I think if you can explain the tone of it, the atmosphere of it, people have a pretty good sense of what is in store for them.<\/p>\n<blockquote class=\"right\">\n<p>A lot of games have replayability but how many do you really remember years down the line?<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<p><strong>Without spoiling anything, we enjoyed how the report at the end of the game highlights the player\u2019s \u2018habits\u2019 and nudges you in directions you may not have investigated. Is the possibility of players \u2018missing\u2019 big chunks of narrative a concern? Is replayability a big consideration for you during development?<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>I\u2019m more focused on making sure people <em>do<\/em> have a personal, unique experience. So for me it\u2019s less that they \u2018missed\u2019 stuff, and more that they saw stuff that only they saw. I\u2019m very much a \u2018play once, but dig in as much as you want\u2019 kind of person, but I know that a lot of people can\u2019t help but want to track down every detail \u2014 so that\u2019s there as an option!<\/p>\n<p>At the end of the day I want to make games that people play intensely when they play them, and remember them long after. Being an intense, memorable experience up front is more important than replayability. A lot of games have replayability but how many do you really remember years down the line?<\/p>\n<figure class=\"picture strip\"><a title=\"Telling Lies Switch Screenshot 05\" href=\"https:\/\/images.nintendolife.com\/69d2fb2be8938\/telling-lies-switch-screenshot-05.original.jpg\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"lazy\" src=\"\/\/www.w3.org\/2000\/svg' viewBox='0 0 900 506'%3E%3C\/svg%3E\" width=\"900\" height=\"506\" data-original=\"https:\/\/images.nintendolife.com\/69d2fb2be8938\/telling-lies-switch-screenshot-05.900x.jpg\" alt=\"Telling Lies Switch Screenshot 05\"><\/a><\/figure>\n<p><strong>The conceit of Telling Lies seems to make playing on PC the most \u2018natural\u2019 home for it, although the game translates to TV play very well \u2013 far better than expected, if we\u2019re honest! Tell us about the process of bringing the game to consoles and the work involved to avoid a sub-optimal experience.<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>We had consoles in mind from the start \u2014 the idea of putting focus on navigating by selecting subtitles directly was a big part of that. But I was surprised and pleased when I first tried it out to see how special the experience of playing on a TV was \u2014 having those windows open up into these private, domestic spaces <em>in your own living room<\/em>, with the actors kinda life sized talking directly to you\u2026 that made things feel intimate in a very different way to phone or computer.<\/p>\n<blockquote class=\"left\">\n<p>Taking the idea of scrutinizing or \u2018deep reading\u2019 live action [&#8230;] and making that a gameplay loop\u2026 I think there\u2019s a lot of ideas we can build on there.<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<p><strong>Do you think there\u2019s room to explore further ideas in the framework of these types of games? Do you have potential ideas that you couldn\u2019t implement here, for whatever reason?<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>Yeah. I think this idea of applying exploration gameplay, all the richness of 3D gameplay <em>directly<\/em> to the story content is something I feel opens up many possibilities. Taking the idea of scrutinizing or \u2018deep reading\u2019 live action (in the way people often do on reddit\/etc!) and making that a gameplay loop\u2026 I think there\u2019s a lot of ideas we can build on there. I get very frustrated now watching shows and movies on my TV and not being able to jump around their timelines and pick up on clues and immediately leap forward in the story!<\/p>\n<p>We had ideas during development that we didn\u2019t use for Telling Lies where they didn\u2019t fit the tone, or the realism of the story. Also some that would have added too much complexity! Some of those made it through to the next game where we have the liberty to be more playful&#8230;<\/p>\n<p><strong>Can you tell us anything about what the future holds or what you\u2019re working on next?<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>We\u2019re currently in development on a horror title that is \u2014 very loosely! \u2014 in the same kind of space as Her Story and Telling Lies. It\u2019s another factor again more complex and ambitious (I am my own worst enemy!) and is looking really cool so far, but we have a ways to go yet! I love the horror genre and had a great time working on the Silent Hill franchise before, so this is fertile ground for me! It\u2019s been exciting to see what we can do with some of these ideas in a genre where we can screw around with player\u2019s heads more.<\/p>\n<aside class=\"object object-youtube\"><\/aside>\n<hr>\n<p><em>Our thanks to Sam. Telling Lies is available now on the Switch eShop. We enjoyed the game a lot &#8211; check out <a href=\"https:\/\/www.nintendolife.com\/reviews\/switch-eshop\/telling_lies\">the Nintendo Life review<\/a> for our full verdict.<\/em><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Over the holiday season we&#8217;ll be republishing a series of Nintendo Life articles, interviews and other features from the previous twelve months that we consider to be our Best of 2020. Hopefully, this will give you a chance to catch up on pieces you missed, or simply enjoy looking back on a year which did [&hellip;]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[27],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-122568","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-nintendo-news"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/sickgaming.net\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/122568","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/sickgaming.net\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/sickgaming.net\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/sickgaming.net\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/2"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/sickgaming.net\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=122568"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/sickgaming.net\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/122568\/revisions"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/sickgaming.net\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=122568"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/sickgaming.net\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=122568"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/sickgaming.net\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=122568"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}